[00:00:00] Speaker A: Do you truly believe it that if you were in that same situation, you had a herniated disc and your back was blown out and you were intense pain that you can't really wake up and walk? Like, do you believe it so much that you're not going to get those injections in your back or you're not going to pop those pills until you go to sleep, or you're not going to do that surgery on your low back or in your neck? Do you believe it so much that the same body that God created is going to heal no matter what? Do you believe that with the utmost integrity when you're the one that's going through that issue? I had to sit there and figure out, do I believe in what I'm telling my patients?
[00:00:36] Speaker B: Hey, everyone. Welcome back to chirocast. I am Dr. Stephanie Brown and I'm here with my amazing co host, Danielle Javines.
[00:00:45] Speaker C: Hey there. We're really excited about today's episode. It's a little different and totally inspiring.
[00:00:50] Speaker B: Right. So today we're taking a step outside the US to, to explore chiropractic care across the globe.
[00:00:58] Speaker C: Yeah. We're talking everything from how care is delivered to how it's perceived culturally to what it's like adjusting in places where the profession looks nothing like it does here in the States.
[00:01:09] Speaker B: Yeah. So to help us unpack all of that, we're joined by someone who's actually been there adjusting, serving, and making a huge impact around the world.
[00:01:17] Speaker C: We are so thrilled to welcome Dr. Maurice Issuo, aka Dr. Moore from Innate's Touch Chiropractic. He's been on mission trips to Haiti, Jamaica and beyond and has a powerful perspective on chiropractic Without Borders.
[00:01:32] Speaker B: Dr. Mo, we're so glad to have you with us. Thanks for joining Chirocast.
[00:01:37] Speaker A: Thank you. That's awesome. Welcome. Right there.
[00:01:40] Speaker B: All right, Dr. Mo, so before we dive in to your experiences abroad, let's start with a little background. So what initially inspired you to become a chiropractor? And, you know, just tell us more about your journey.
[00:01:51] Speaker A: Okay, so chiropractic wasn't something that I experienced growing up in life.
My parents are foreigners, so they came from Nigeria. And I was in my senior year in undergrad, and there was a guy who came into our class and he was like, we will cover your application fee for you to get to apply to go to Park University. And at this time, I'm like, broke college student, don't have money. So I'm like, all right, that's cool. Like someone's going to cover that fee. I'll just try it out. And so they had this parker power weekend where you can go and see if you want to join the school.
And at that point, I was already thinking, you know, chiropractic would be cool. You know, I'll give it a chance.
And so I went and went to the parker power weekend. Had a good time. It was fun. Definitely something new to me. I was like, I never really experienced that amount of energy and those different people. And when I thought of a doctor at school, I was like, okay, it's going to be a whole bunch of people in white coats, but it's a lot of people who are just cool and down to earth people. And so I was like, I can definitely do this. So then I applied, got in, and that kind of kick started what chiropractic was for me.
[00:03:08] Speaker B: At what point did travel start to come into play or.
[00:03:11] Speaker A: Yeah, so when I was an undergrad, I was on academic probation. I was not really a school kind of guy.
I didn't like to just sit in class all day, and I didn't apply myself so much coming out. I used to play football. So that energy of just go to practice, you're going to pass your classes, just get through it. I was still had that lingering on me as I was in college. And so I was just kind of going through classes, putting in the bare minimum effort. And so whenever I got into chiropractic school, I told myself, I am going to actually try and apply myself and actually study and work hard. And so my first trimester, all I did was just study school in the libraries, day in, day out, waking up, going to the library, going after school. And I got a four point on my first trimester. And so that's why I was like, hey, wow. Like, okay, I'm actually smart, you know.
[00:04:09] Speaker B: So like, whoa, I can do this.
[00:04:11] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. And so once I got past that first trimester, I was like, okay, let me see what else comes with this chiropractic thing. And I bumped to my mentor at that time, Dr. David Bynum. He's out here in Texas. And he was my first real experience of the philosophy of chiropractic and then the art, too. And all I knew was at this point, muscles, tendons, nerves, ligaments. It was tri when we're learning anatomy. And so. But I didn't really know about what the adjustment can do. And he shifted the gears for me in that perspective. So then I really started focusing on how can I get my hands as certified as possible before I go out there into the real world. And now these people really are depending on you to deliver a certain service. And so it was about try three. So I'm now six, seven months into the program, where I got approached by one of my good friends, Sergey, and he was like, hey, you should come to this mission trip. And it was in Haiti, and it was offered by Dr. Peter Morgan, who's a legend in the game of chiropractic. And the things that he's done for the profession is unheard of. And I just have a lot of love for that guy. And so Dr. Morgan had this mission trip, and he was like, hey, right now, not a lot of people are going to Haiti. It was, like, a rough time. I think it was after some type of natural disaster.
And he said, if you bring at least eight people with you that pay for the mission trip and get their flights by this certain date, then I'll go with you to Haiti. Otherwise, we're not taking Parker out to Haiti. They were working more with life west, because there was a way that they could have gotten, like, external credits and clinics. So they already had a system going. But with Parker, it wasn't really a thing at this time. Back in 2019, definitely before COVID So, yeah, 2019. And so I got, like, eight of my buddies, got the crew, and we went out to Haiti. And it was a transformational experience. It was something I never experienced before, seeing people who, as far as financially, aren't the same as you, but their happiness was. It seemed more, you know, than how it is in the states, and their gratefulness was higher, and the ability to play and have fun with each other was very shocking to me, because usually when you hear mission trips, the perception is just like, a sad, like, you know, you know, experience. And so that's kind of how my headspace was at going into. It was okay, like, let me just try to help as much as possible. When I got there, there was kids outside playing soccer, and the. The goals weren't even like, they were just rocks. And I was watching how much they had fun. I went out there, too, and I started playing with them. And the amount of fun that the whole community and the environment was having was way different than playing soccer in the states, where people all have their attitudes, and you did this and you did that, and not really generally enjoying the energy and the confluence of people meeting together for just fun and play, you know, real good play. And that shifted my mind also. Seeing people look at you and they ask, you can you help their child with anything that's going on. You know, in the States, it's very, okay, my kid has this. And they have a dairy allergy and all these different things. And so they're trying to hone down on which person can help them. When you go out into Haiti, in particular the Dominican Republic, they. They don't care if you're internal doctor, if you're a chiropractor, if you're neural, it doesn't matter. Like, you are the only doctor to them.
[00:08:25] Speaker C: So I was gonna ask you, did they know you guys were chiropractors coming in, or they just. They saw doctors showing up and they were gonna get help?
[00:08:33] Speaker A: Well, because of his influence already in Haiti, they. Most people, not all of them kind of already knew that we were all chiropractors, and we come, like, quarterly to come and serve the community.
So most of them knew that. But some people who are new, they don't know. They just call us touch healers and, like, creole. And so they really, like, think of it as chiropractic. They just knew that if we adjusted them that they would get better. And so there was times where they would just hand their kids that have, like, sickness from whatever sort. They'll have masses coming out of their neck. They'll have open wounds, they'll have a broken, like, wrist or something, and they'll literally just hand, like, here, you know, because there's not any other doctor that's coming down there at all. So to them, you're just everything. Whatever condition they have, it doesn't matter under the sun, they're sending you to them. I've seen multiple kids. My first mission trip of a kid who.
Who couldn't see, their vision was blurred. And I adjusted them, you know, and then they went and left, and I was okay, and I was just. How it is in Haiti is as soon as you put your table down wherever in the community, they all just rush to the table. Most out of curiosity, like, who's in our community? Like, what's going on? But then also some people familiar know or get told, like, hey, you should go over there and get adjusted.
And it's just a lot of kids, they're just having fun, and so the table gets really crowded, and it's just full, like, 15, 20, 30 people even just waiting to either go or just watching and laughing and playing. And, you know, I adjusted this one kid that had a vision issue, and then they left, and I was just adjusting more people. And then they came back with their mom and said, that he could see like his vision was coming back. And.
Yeah. And, you know, being in that, that space and seeing what chiropractic could do, it really changed my perspective on what we're actually doing when we're coming here. You know, it's not just coming to just adjust people and practice your skill.
This is something that people.
The number one, one of the biggest things that helps people heal is instilling hope into them. And the moment that we, like, lay feet on that land, all of them get hope. All of them get hope that whatever they have going on will somehow be resolved. And, you know, with that hope, you have to be able to match with your certainty and confidence in what you're delivering. And that transcends all logic at times and all ideologies and beliefs is, you know, I'm certain that what I'm doing is true. I know that when I'm adjusting and moving that joint, that I'm being honest. And it's with the utmost integrity that if you have hope that you'll get better, then if God's present in that space, which he is, then that healing is going to occur. And so we were having healings all the time when we would go to Haiti. People who can't use their arms, using their arms again. There was a girl, and I have this posted on my Instagram and she was, she was paralyzed for six years, like since birth. She wasn't able to use her legs. And you know, and the craziest part about this was I didn't even adjust her legs or anything, but I adjusted her upper cervical and her family and everybody was there. And that was her first time taking steps since she was ever born after that adjustment and.
And we just continue to have these kind of experience every time we go to Haiti. I started, I mean, after that first time that I went, I knew that I was going to come back as much as I can through school. And so Parker worked in like 15 week trimesters and then you would have about two weeks off before you start the next trimester. And every time I had a break, I would go. And then it started going to the point sometimes where I was like going during school. Like, I would just take my test on the plane or take it when I get to Haiti and just like looking for Wi Fi, you know, and.
But it became a family, a unit. There was an orphanage that we had down there. So most of the, like kids that came there, that's where we would stay most of the time would be in that orphanage or at A hotel bordering in Dominican. And so coming back and you seeing these kids over and over, and then they start getting older and they get taller, and they're, like, getting facial hair, and then they're just, like, growing.
[00:13:25] Speaker C: Remember you when you do?
[00:13:27] Speaker A: Oh, yeah. Oh, I mean, yeah, absolutely.
[00:13:29] Speaker B: And they remember Dr. Mo.
[00:13:31] Speaker A: Yeah. They would, like, message me on, like, Facebook. And it's funny because, like, at first when I was thinking of it and got Their Facebook was just like, okay. You know, I thought nothing of it. I was like, cool. Like, I'm just going to miss y'all. See y'all when I get back. And they'll, like, message you instantly as soon as you get back home, like, hey, how are you? And they speak Creole, but, you know, are able to translate it enough for it to be in English. And so then I'm like, okay, you know, I'll answer them back. But, you know, when you get back into the States, you're going back to normal life. Like, you're taking tests, you're doing all this stuff. So you're not really, like, messaging everybody back. They'll literally text you, like, hey, how are you? Like, every single day, you know, all day, I'm all like, okay. And so, yeah. But then as I was coming back, I started to see what they really needed, you know, and we started doing a lot for the community. So at that point, every time I was coming back, I was being a bigger and a bigger group to now, like, Parker's one of the, like, most active schools. In that mission trip, going to Haiti to do chiropractic care.
The last one I was on was, like, 60, 70 students and doctors that came down to go and serve the people. And we would just bring back bag bags of clothes for them, shoes. I would bring, like, my old laptops, phones, different things to basically help them get through school. Was my main priority is to just make sure that they have the, like, necessities. They need that or anything that I can do to get closer to that goal so that they can create a better life and dynamic for what they have going on there. And so it was really cool and a fun experience, and I'm excited to go back to Haiti. I haven't been in over a year now since I started clinic, but I've been to different places that kind of kickstarted my mission trip experience.
I started to get reached out by different organizations to go to different places. So, you know, I went to Jamaica and did a mission trip out there, and then now going to Uganda here in, like, two Weeks.
[00:15:47] Speaker C: That's awesome.
Didn't. So did that, that initial Haiti trip, did that inspire your clinic, your name, your group, your principles and how you practice?
[00:16:02] Speaker A: I feel, I feel like, so I would say that it was definitely a component to it. All the different experiences that I've had leading up to the point of opening my clinic, I feel like contributed to the overall goal in the mission.
The name Innate's touch. I know Dr. Stephanie knows a lot about innate intelligence and how the body has the ability to heal regardless if you want it to or not. That's just how great God created the body and what's possible, you know, and it's, it's the same reason that grows the hair out of your head and you know, grows your nails continuously. It's the same thing that pushes the grass through the concrete. Whenever people try to create this concrete jungle, nature is always going to be here when we're here and when we leave, nature's still going to be here. And no matter how they try to destroy it or change it. And our, the same innate intelligence that creates that body of water to move and the grass to grow is the same intelligence that pumps the blood through our body and, you know, creates the oxygen that we breathe. And so when I came up with the name, I was in like a ceremony of meditation and it came through like a Nate's touch, which means that for me it means God that is through me is that that touch is what I'm delivering to the people. And so, yeah, that's how I came up with the name.
[00:17:47] Speaker C: That's awesome. And so you, so you mentioned you are you're going to make it a more recurring theme to visit different countries periodically throughout the year. Is that something you're looking to do more in the future, right?
[00:18:01] Speaker A: Yeah, I want to, I do want to hyper focus in on the clinics that I'm working on just to make sure I'm giving it the utmost attention and making sure that it's like stabilized the way it's supposed to be. So I would say like 20, 25, I'm going to just focus more on that. But sometimes, I mean, I do get reached out to go to certain places like Uganda and can't pass that up. Yeah, if it works out, then, you know, I definitely try to, to make it happen. But I do want to devote more time into doing mission trips again. I, I, when I was in school, I went over 10 in like three years. So I was just pretty much always on the plane and my parents were just like, you're Leaving again. And, you know, there was times that we would leave after, like, every natural disaster that would happen somewhere. I know Haiti got hit with, like, a tsunami, went that next week after that. And so during, like, pivotal moments where they really need help, you know, we would just literally hop on the plane and go and head out there or.
I mean, there was a time where they. Politically. It's been crazy politically in Haiti actually lately, but it was worse at a point where the president just got assassin. This is after. I don't know if y'all familiar with that, but there was like, three or four presidents getting assassin at that time. But that's a whole another topic there and then.
But you can imagine what that can do to a country. And so when we were going down there, for me, it wasn't too bad because I can almost blend in with the Haitians. Like, they don't. They think I'm Haitian. When I go there, they're just like, you know, como y creel. I'm like, nah, American. And, you know, but for my colleagues that are white, you know, and they go to Haiti, there's a lot of times that there's, like, challenges and difficulties with that. During. During this period, right when the president got assassinated, there was a lot of riots and, like, crazy stuff going on. Blocking of the bridges, people putting, like, picket signs in.
In Port au Prince. That's where most of the violence is. And them attacking, kidnapping people, you know, that are American and holding them for ransom. That's more so where it was at. But Port au Prince would be like the big city in Haiti, so.
But where we were going was in the villages. So it would be about, like, six, seven hours out of Port au Prince, bordering Dominican, the border between Dominican and Haiti in this place called Wanna Men.
And so that's where we would create the nucleus. And then we would just all spread out through there and go to different, like, churches and different villages that they know us so much that when we come or they see our bus that says Cairo missions, they'll all just start running out of their houses and getting. Wanting to get adjusted. And so it was, like, safer for us on that aspect. But there was, you know, times where some of the, like, political matters started to even reach down there where it was just wild. But now.
Yeah, yeah, but now it's getting way, way better. This last three or four mission trips, they're out there right now, actually in Haiti. They just left two days ago to spend a week out there and, you know, it's fine. So.
[00:21:40] Speaker C: Sounds like That's a factor to consider whether you're visiting on a mission trip or maybe even considering moving abroad and taking your chiropractic practice out. I know, like, I visited a chiropractor in Mexico. Very different than here in the States. I don't want to say, like, the priorities are. Well, they are a little different. Like, they. There was no mention of care plans or anything like that. And just like, the. The attention to. To the care and like, what you're getting is very different when you go abroad.
So when. When you guys go to Haiti or when you go anywhere, are there any chiropractor business? Is there, or you guys are the only chiropractic experience that they're, you know, exposed to?
[00:22:25] Speaker A: Yeah, from the last time I checked, it's just us. I still haven't. Well, Dr. Morgan was. He's been having this plan for a long time to try to, like, open a chiropractic school in Haiti, but I don't know, like, where his progress is on that.
But as far as now, there's not any clinics. When we come. We're the chiropractors. But it's really cool because some of the kids from the orphanage, they have. We've came so many times, and they've watched us because they are translators as well. So we just pay them to translate, you know, to. To let people. When they tell us what's going on, they can tell us in English. And they watch this so much all the time that they even know how to do some of the adjustments. It's crazy when I just watch him. Yeah. I'm like, oh, my God, he just did really good. And he's like, 16. Yeah.
And so I believe that there's a lot of magic in that place and that. That culture is so rich in knowledge and, like, sacred knowledge and the abilities for them to learn things so quickly and on the fly, like, that is. Is really magical. I've seen a lot of Haitians know, like, five or six different languages, and it's just incredible. They just switch from Spanish to Creole to English to French. Then they're speaking German. I'm like, that is so cool. You know, whenever you have that type of community and space to truly unlock those parts of your brain, because I'm on duolingo for, like, 60 days trying to learn Spanish. It's still hard.
[00:24:15] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:24:16] Speaker A: Like, you know, they're like, 17, 18, and they know four or five different languages. It's just. It's really brilliant. And many people not. Will never know how intelligent and how developed some of these kids are, but they just don't have the opportunity. You know, they're just kind of trapped in their own environment and people just never know how brilliant they are. They can, they're beautiful musicians and very talented, but they're just, they can't get out of there.
[00:24:44] Speaker C: The re. Well, the resources, they're very different.
I think we're so mainstream with what we have. We're so used to having, you know, access to Internet and things that nowadays are considered basic necessities that other countries, they're not as developed and so their time is spent elsewhere, not tied to electronic devices or Internets and things like that.
[00:25:10] Speaker A: That is so true.
[00:25:12] Speaker B: Mentioned that you went to Jamaica I think once. Were there any differences really that you. That stood out to you from caring for people there versus in Haiti?
[00:25:23] Speaker A: I would say.
Well, with Haiti, I think that in that mission trip it was so established and the, the community is so involved in what we do as far as chiropractic wise, that they were more receptive where in Jamaica they were more hesitant on like, who are you? Why are you helping me? Like, what's going on?
And so it took a lot of, a lot more communication to get them to lay on the table or talking to the pastor and really helping the pastor translate to them that we're really here to help with no strings attached. We're just trying to help people out. But as far as delivering the care, I feel like it was pretty much the same. There wasn't many restrictions or limitations at all.
And so people would come with different things as well and you know, we would just love on them.
[00:26:21] Speaker B: Got it. You know, if chiropractic is like a regulated profession in Jamaica or Haiti for that matter.
[00:26:29] Speaker A: Oh, you said regulated.
[00:26:30] Speaker B: Like is it formally like a profession where they, someone could go there and practice and be licensed or.
[00:26:36] Speaker A: I would say, I would say there, I mean anything's possible, but I would.
[00:26:42] Speaker B: Say right now, I guess.
[00:26:44] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. But in would say more in Jamaica than in Haiti. You could probably open up, practice and get it going. But in Haiti, I mean, maybe in Port au Prince, but I haven't been. I was in Port au Prince once, but this is before all the riots and everything. And pretty much ever since it's been pretty chaotic. I just don't fly into that airport.
So I don't, I, I, I wouldn't think. But in the villages, no, there's not, yeah, there's not really much regulations. You can, I mean, you're the doctor for everything. So like pregnant Ladies, everybody's come to you. We actually opened up a birthing center in Haiti, which was, like, super awesome because we just saw the lack of care for pregnant moms and some of the struggles that they were going through whenever they were going through the birthing process. So we just raised a whole bunch of money and found a spot right next to the orphanage. So that was really convenient too, and created a space for those moms. And now there's like 12, 15 different pregnancies every week.
[00:27:54] Speaker C: Wow.
[00:27:55] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:27:56] Speaker C: And you guys are still running those facilities or. I imagine there's locals that have to assist with running it.
[00:28:04] Speaker A: Yeah, Midwives. Highest and midwives. So they work out of there. And then we come down about every month to two months. The group of us and Dr. Morgan and Dr. Henry Rosenbaum, they created a program where you can get CE credits and then also get certified in like, like pediatric chiropractic. And so that time that you're in Haiti for the week, you'll basically, you'll be treating people, and then the other half you'll spend at the birthing center learning everything about babies. And then at the end of it, you get your certification and. Wow, CE credit.
[00:28:51] Speaker C: Yeah, if there's any. So if there are chiropractors or maybe up and coming chiropractors that are interested in getting into this type of work, what resources would you, you know, send to them or where would you tell them to look?
[00:29:04] Speaker A: I would go to chiromissions.com all of the links and things, you know, as far as the seminars and the mission trips to all there. I know that a lot of the insiders reached out to me after knowing about the mission trip, which I love them for that. That was super cool that they, you know, are they.
They could feel, you know, the.
I guess the experience through me, and I didn't really even talk much about it. And that's what I like about chiropractors is that they are just a different level of intention and stuff. And so. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And so, yeah, they reached out and they want to go on a mission trip, so I sent them some information about it too, so.
[00:29:49] Speaker C: Huh. That's awesome.
That's really cool.
In places where chiropractic is less understood, what would you say are the biggest barriers to patient acceptance?
[00:30:03] Speaker A: I would say language is the first one, for sure. Yeah. Once you don't speak their language, it's kind of like a.
Yes. A barrier, for sure.
[00:30:13] Speaker B: Do you guys bring models of spines with you to try to point?
[00:30:17] Speaker A: Yeah, no, we don't but that. Honestly. Well, we have the translators. That helps a lot, and we educate the translators as much as possible on what we're doing, and so that helps them if we do bump into it, that kind of issue. But what I learned in Haiti is just, like, your presence and certainty can translate all language.
[00:30:42] Speaker C: And so he doesn't care. Like, they don't care, you know, about the L5, L6. They don't care about the vertebrae. They just. They want help and hope. Yeah, the education piece is like, yeah, that's cool and all, but.
[00:30:57] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. And. And honestly, it's. I like it. I like treating in Haiti, and I feel like so many more miracles, like, in that one week, well, like, we could all count, like, 60 miracles that should not have happened due to logic of what people believe, but is happening every day. And I think it's because there's less regulations and there's less beliefs. Really. A lot of the beliefs in the states are limiting people, you know.
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And, you know, they have, you know, like, different egos on certain situations, on, oh, you can't help me because my. My doctor said that you guys are only good for headaches or whatever it may be. But in Haiti, like I said, they think you're the doctor for everything. And so, you know, when you. When you work on them, it's. It's a very beautiful thing when you're. You. Your work is true and you believe in what you're doing, and, you know, it works, and you're using good clinical judgment, People get better. Like, so, like, in just that week, they'll come, like, two times, three times, and whatever they have going on will be better. Um, and I feel like in the States, you still have those experiences, but it's. It's more space.
[00:32:22] Speaker C: Yeah, well, because I think over here, like, everything is. If it's not published in a medical journal and it's not mainstream and everyone's doing it, then, you know, people are less likely to believe in it or want to even give it a shot. So I. I mean, I perceive as, like, in the States, where it's like, chiropractic is. It's getting better, but, I mean, it's not where it could be as far as the percept perception goes, whereas in other countries, it is so widely accepted, it doesn't matter if you're even licensed. They don't care.
[00:32:53] Speaker A: They don't care.
[00:32:53] Speaker C: It's like, if you know what you're doing and you can help them, help them.
[00:32:57] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:32:57] Speaker C: But here it's Like Steph said, we all get in our own way.
[00:33:01] Speaker A: And I believe that, you know, what you said when it's like, can you help me? Because at the end of the day, when you take everything away, like all the beliefs and the ideas, at the end of the day, that's all they really want to know. You know, like, can you help me? And how much is it going to cost? Yeah, how long is it going to take? Those are just the three main things that every person wants to know. If you go anywhere, if you could go and do physical therapy, or if you go and do yoga to get better at stretching, or if you're going to go get your teeth cleaned, you just want to know how much, how long can you help me fix this issue? And you know, whenever you're in that space where it's free, you know, and you know that you can help them, then they literally get help. Like nine times out of 10, they get better no matter what you do, you know. And Sigafus, he's chiropractic philosopher by the way, he was saying that, you know, whenever you are like, you're philosophy philosophically sound in what you do, that you could kick them in the butt and they'll get better.
And you know, I definitely paraphrase that one. But pretty much when you're so certain in what you believe and you know that are working, you instill the hope. It doesn't matter what kind of adjustment you do at that point, because that's what they needed at that time and everything aligned for that divine appointment that no matter what you do at that point, that person's going to get better. And that's what it's been on my mind a lot lately because I, I truly believe in chiropractic more and more every day. But I jumped into it like I just drank the Kool Aid. I went all the way into when I was even sure. I mean, I didn't have anybody, I didn't have a miracle story. I didn't have any father or uncle that was a chiropractor that did really amazing cool stuff. Like I went from just regular life and then got jumped into watching miracles happen every day. And you know, it's different whenever you're watching it, but then whenever you have to experience it like in your own, that's whenever it becomes more like tangible and it, it sinks in more.
And I've watched miracles happen that I've delivered in certain experiences from different age ranges. And like, I knew chiropractic would work. So it was okay. And I had an understanding for it, but it was different. Whenever it has to do with you and your health and you have something going on, that's what really tests the chiropractor. That's what really tests the doctor. You know, it like, yeah, you're telling all these people, if you do your exercise and you do this and you do that and you don't need medicine. However, chiropractor gets down and how they communicate to them that they should be doing chiropractic care.
Do you. Do you truly believe it that if you were in that same situation, you had a herniated disc and your back was blown out and you were intense pain that you can't really wake up and walk? Like, do you believe it so much that you're not going to get those injections in your back or you're not going to pop those pills until you go to sleep, or you're not going to do that surgery on your low back or in your neck? Do you believe it so much that you know that the same body that God created is going to heal no matter what? Do you believe that with the utmost integrity when you're the one that's going through that issue? And I had, like, two situations where that's how I know, how sound I am in my philosophy. And it made me a better practitioner, too, whenever I'm delivering care. Because I went through that experience where I ruptured my Achilles, like, off the bone, you know, rolled into my calf. And, you know, I sat there with myself and, you know, prayed and I fasted for three days. And I was wondering, do I need to do surgery on this leg right here? And with people that you love and people that you trust and different orthos that are, like, became friends? Like, I'm friends with all different types of doctors, you know, even if they don't believe all the way in everything, you know, we can still connect on and resonate on certain levels. And I asked for their advice on things, and people that I really care about told me, like, you need to do surgery. Like, you're young and you want to be able to run and do things again. I would do a surgery on it, but my chiropractic philosophy tells me that the body heals, right? So, like, how do you. What is it to you?
What is your. Your stance and what do you believe? And so I end up not doing that surgery, and I'm fine. I mean, I saw me last week, you know, or whatever, weekends ago, to cut that story short. But I had to sit there and figure out, do I believe in what I'm telling my patients? There's so many patients that have a shoulder issue. We do mri. Their rotator cuff is torn up. Right, doc? Do I need to get surgery or can I. Can I heal this thing naturally? All right, so if I'm telling them that I believe that they can heal this thing naturally, but then I'm in the same sense going and running to go do something, how much confidence can I instill into my patients? You know? And I believe that this surgery for a situation, I'm not saying that never do it, you know, but what I'm. You know, what I'm saying is that I really believe that no man with a scalpel can do better work than what God can do in the body. And whenever you put the body in environment to heal, it will heal. But if you put a body in environment where there's negative thoughts, there's negative toxins being put into it, and then the people around you don't believe that you can heal you in that six, eight weeks, you're not going to get. You're not going to get the same results. And so I believe in that firmly, too. And I've had a herniated disc in my neck where my whole right arm was numb for a month straight. And I was still practicing, and I was just young and in my head, like, it's gonna get better, whatever. But it wasn't. It was a sequester disc just floating in my epidural, like, just ruining my life. Excruciating pain. And I thought to myself at those times, like. Like, I would get a steroid shot in my neck right now. Like, I like waking up with that kind of pain. I can see why people go and they're like, yo, cut the nerve. Do whatever you gotta do. I don't want this pain anymore. Like, I could. I can feel that on a deeper level that when my patients come and I look in their eyes and they are like, their eyes are shaky and they're in pain, I know where they're at. And I know that there's better days to come. I know that you will get well, because I've sat in that same chair and I felt that. And I'm grateful to God to be able to experience those situations because it was tough and some points depressing. Whenever you're injured and you don't feel good, you know, you get in your head a lot because you can't run and do certain activities because of the pain and the. The Injury. But I'm very grateful for those experience to show how the body can overcome what can happen. Whenever you lean into the philosophy that, I mean, if you believe in it, then it's true.
[00:39:49] Speaker C: And, and it's okay to slow down. I think we're, our culture is, you know, go, go, go all the time. There's, you know, not very many people take time for meditating and truly slowing down and listening to their bodies. So I think when those injuries arise, like being forced to slow down, it's depressing. You know, you're not outgoing, like what you're conditioned to go do, but you learn so much about yourself in those moments and you can truly tap into your energy, which is also beautiful.
[00:40:25] Speaker A: Yes, ma'am.
[00:40:26] Speaker B: In general, I mean, facts don't require beliefs. And so that's the thing, like, a lot of people will say, like, oh, well, I don't believe in chiropractic, thankfully, they don't need to believe in chiropractic for it to work. I think it helps if you do believe because then you're not getting in the way. Like we were kind of saying before how, like, we get in our own way with it. Pretty much.
[00:40:48] Speaker A: Yeah, that is so true.
[00:40:49] Speaker B: But yeah, I think that's the thing. Like, you're literally working against it then. Yeah, you're probably going to feel like it doesn't work or it's not great for you or whatever.
[00:40:56] Speaker A: Yeah, that is so true. Yeah, I thought about the other day because, like, sometimes I'm just like driving on a long drive and like, I'll space out and my mind will be thinking about certain things. And I was thinking about, like, chiropractic is the one profession that is like a natural healing, that it doesn't matter who you are, if you're Muslim or if you're Christian or if you're Republican or Democrat. It doesn't matter what you are. If you lay on the table, the healing will go past all generations, all heights, weights. It will occur, you know, through that tool we call chiropractic.
[00:41:31] Speaker B: So I have to you this question, though, from a chiropractic belief standpoint. You do you think there is a limitation of matter, or might you argue there isn't or not as much as people think there is?
[00:41:45] Speaker A: Yeah, that is definitely one of those questions.
Okay.
Yeah, because that gets deep right there.
Honestly, I don't even know what I believe on that anymore. I go back and forth on that one a lot where I'm like, I don't, you know, lately I've Been feeling like there's no limitations to anything.
[00:42:08] Speaker B: Got it.
[00:42:09] Speaker A: When you get called to be a chiropractor, I feel like that's just, God, like, all the way through and through because, like, what's the chances, you know, that it all aligned and worked out for you that you're like, I think I'm.
[00:42:23] Speaker C: I like how you drop a line in there. No pun intended. Yeah, it all aligned.
[00:42:28] Speaker B: Oh, yeah.
[00:42:28] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:42:29] Speaker C: I think. I mean, anybody that is thinking about becoming a chiropractor or has been in the industry for many years, like, it takes a special person to dedicate their life to the profession. And I've only ever met unique and amazing individuals in the chiropractic industry. I've never met anybody that I wouldn't consider a friend.
[00:42:50] Speaker A: Yeah, it's crazy. It's like, as a chiropractor, you have to be a little crazy because you think that you can lay your hands on people and they'll get better. It's like, what are you saying?
[00:43:03] Speaker B: Hilarious.
[00:43:03] Speaker C: It's amazing is what it is.
[00:43:05] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:43:06] Speaker B: Hey, question. When you have traveled and been adjusting, I mean, the way you practice is how you practice in terms of, like, techniques and whatnot. But do you ever do different techniques or like, other colleagues you're traveling with? Are you all sort of adjusting the same way or are there different techniques?
If so, I mean, do the patients recognize, like, oh, there's more than one way to do this?
[00:43:31] Speaker A: So when it was in Haiti, it was more so people from my. The company Hand Alchemy, like, students that were coming to the seminars and were coming to the clubs and really engulfed in that technique and approach to it, the above, down inside out. So, like, majority of them were doing that technique and that approach to it, but there was all different. Like, there was a Gonstead guy out there and a couple of Gonstead people from, like, Palmer, Florida is really big in Gonstead. So there's a couple of Gonstead people out there.
Activator.
Yeah, there's different. There's different people with different things. And I mean, at the end of the day, chiropractic works regardless.
[00:44:16] Speaker C: So it's welcome. Doesn't matter. You know, if they're looking over and they see something a little different, it's welcomed. It's just, I'm going to go get in that line next and experience that.
[00:44:25] Speaker A: Yeah, they'll get adjusted like, nine times sometimes, like, yo, you just got adjusted. They just want to get this.
[00:44:30] Speaker C: I'm a big fan. I'm a big fan. I Always say, like, when we go to seminars, I'm like, this is my moment to get 15 adjustments in a day.
Jury's still out on whether or not that's healthy. I'm okay. I feel great about it. But, I mean, I'm sure some folks would be like, all right, let's chill. Give your spine a break.
[00:44:49] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:44:50] Speaker B: I have a tough question. When you've been traveling, adjusting, have has there ever been a patient that you were aware of or someone else, you know, a colleague that was with you where you all said, you know, we're not going to adjust you, or we can't or we shouldn't, you know? Has there ever been a time where you did not adjust somebody?
[00:45:10] Speaker A: No.
[00:45:11] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:45:12] Speaker A: Yeah. It's like, no, we always find a way. For sure. Like, there was a lady that.
She's like, super old, like 90 something years old, and she was bedridden, you know, so they actually, like, found me outside in the village and said, hey, can you come with me to my grandmother's house so you can adjust her? And at first I was just like, should I trust this? And so then I like, you know, yeah, like, we're adjusting out here. What's going on? So, you know, I asked the lead, Dr. Morgan, about it, and he was like, yeah, absolutely, you know, take a translator with you. And, you know, and I went and I saw her, and she was, like, very. Just crippled and very stiff and almost rigor mortis looking, you know, and.
And all I did was just her upper cervicals, you know, and she was able to just start, like, moving her body more, and she. She started smiling and, you know, her circulation. Yes, yes. Yeah, absolutely. And, you know, there's just. If any place in Haiti, it's like you just even laying your hands on them, you know, and just being intentional, just letting the love and warmth come from your hands. They.
I mean, I call that adjustment in itself, too, you know, even if I don't do, like, a actual osseous adjustment on somebody because of, like, a broken bone or some tumor or something, then just. Even just like, laying my hands on them or, you know, on certain chakra points, something, you know, then like acupress.
[00:46:51] Speaker C: Like, acupressure points or, like, touching. I've seen adjustments where, like, I observed. I don't know what it's called, so if you guys can help me. Where it's like they are barely touching, like, the very top of your skin in certain areas of the body, and they do it in different areas. But it looked like I've Seen you do it on your adjustments where it's like in the top, you'll barely touch and then you pull your hand away quickly. I feel like people would look at it and like, wow, you're not even moving the bone, you're not moving the joint, but it's still effective and you're still working the nerves and like the circulatory system of the body. So I feel like no matter what, like, like you said, putting your hands on somebody, it could be beneficial.
[00:47:28] Speaker B: That might have been network. There's some other light force techniques.
And so I practice mostly TRT and like the system of analysis that I use, at least for the first part is similar to that. It's not the adjustment itself when I'm doing it, but. Yeah, similar.
[00:47:48] Speaker C: Yeah, I think it's amazing. Like I watched, I think her name, I don't remember her last name. I just remember her first name was Dr. Olivia. And she like, she would just barely touch the person and they would be laying on the table in different spots. And it like, it didn't look like there was any pressure at all. And she'd pull her hand way quickly. And I was just in awe because people were like, you know, I feel amazing. And I was like, I was skeptical of her. So I was like, you know, she's not moving the bone. She's not like adjusting in what I thought was like a traditional adjustment, but the line behind her table was just like a mile long. And I was like, this is interesting, I want to see more. And of course there's videos all over the place, but I thought it was amazing just watching along. So I imagine taking that into other countries could be, you know, remarkable there as well.
[00:48:37] Speaker B: I'll say too, like even here when. Because like for me, when my, my, the chiropractor that I used to work for basically came back from a seminar. I don't know what he came back from, but he basically came back and was like, we're doing this now. And it was TRT with an integrator. And I was just like, what? And like, you know, we were like these heavy handed manual. I probably was not heavy handed because I'm a small person, but you know, these very manual adjusters, like doing traditional, like diversified adjustments and drop table and you know, very manual techniques. Now we're just gonna like tap people and click them with this thing. Like, you've got to be kidding me right now. So I was super skeptical, which is saying a lot for someone, a chiropractor. But I was. And even More so than normal, but. And so I was just like, like rolling my eyes at it kind of. And then as I was trained and I learned and really though it was when I started doing it myself with patients, you know, I still have those moments where I adjust someone and I'd say, like, holy poop. Like, oh, works. Like, yeah, when I. When we shifted techniques and I had to learn something different. It was super interesting to watch people resp to it. And I mean, these are some of these people we'd been seeing for a very long time, my boss, decades, some of them kind of. And going back, I think, to what something Dr. Mo said before. But like, even here in the States, we change techniques and most of our patients literally did not care. We were totally shocked. We thought for sure everyone would quit and leave.
And they really don't care what you're doing as long as they have that experience of whether it's healing, get better, feel better, stay better, whatever it is that they're coming into you, for as long as that happens, they don't care how you do it. Now, as a licensed practitioner, you obviously should be doing something that's legit. So you don't want to be like lying to people or making stuff up. But so it does matter what you do in that regard. But in terms of patience, like, they really didn't care. All they cared about was the outcome.
[00:50:41] Speaker C: So that's similar. And like when you go abroad where they don't care what technique or what you're bringing and you just, your hands are on them and they're gonna feel better, they're gonna get better, and they believe it because you believe it.
That's remarkable. So would you say that everybody, whether you, you know, been in the business for years, whether you're a student, should everybody experience going abroad at least once and.
[00:51:07] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:51:09] Speaker C: Yeah, you would?
[00:51:09] Speaker A: Absolutely. Oh yeah, absolutely. It's, I mean, just something to your heart, you know, Like, I mean, I feel like in my earlier years being a football player and everything, I wasn't like the most heart opening kind of dude. And like culturally, culturally I wasn't like taught as a man to be like super open and vulnerable and things like that.
But throughout, like doing a lot of self work and you know, going like healing a lot of my behaviors that were holding me back.
But going to Haiti was a very, very big factor in like really being able to move love through my body and be an example of love and learning how to forgive and learning how to have grace. Because, you know, when you're out there and you're seeing these people have a less fortunate circumstances than you. Like they don't have TVs and all these different things and the things that we take for granted now, they just don't have anything like that at all. It makes you really just look. And when you go back to states, think of things very differently. Maybe be a little bit less materialistic, maybe you don't need that item again.
And not saying you can't enjoy the good things, but it just opens up another perspective. What is really important, you know, what is, you know, and that's love, that's connection, that fellowship. That is truly one of the main reasons that I feel like we are put on this planet is to serve. How can you be of service to people, but to all people, you know, and, and that's where I'm working on more and more every day, is to like let go of some of these manufactured identities that was created from just different experiences in my life and being in different institutions and following so many.
[00:53:09] Speaker C: Rules and societal norms.
[00:53:12] Speaker A: Societal norms, yeah. It literally just created a, a robot almost of like, hey, how you doing? And you're just like, I didn't even really care how they were doing. You're just saying it to say it. And like not generally slowing down your heart and connecting and resonating with all people. And I think that's what, you know, what we're supposed to be doing. And I'm, you know, getting better at that. And I think that Haiti really gave me opportunity in Jamaica and the Dominican Republic and just everywhere that I'm going, I'm excited to go to Uganda to just serve that, you know, that area too is how can, you know, whoever can create the best resonance, I feel like is the one who's going to find success follows that, you know, it follows the ones that can actually connect to people and not try to connect for like, what can you do for me? How can I gain something from that? You know, because everything that you already need, you already have that you're not lacking anything. It's a perception of lack, you know, and a perception of poverty. But really everything you have your heart, you know, your ability to walk and move and use your eyes and smell. All of these are God given birthrights. But we neglected a lot because we want to make sure we have the new car and we have the new this and the new that that it clouds and it creates these behaviors and these ideologies of who we think we are. When that's when you sit silently with Yourself, you know, do you feel like you're sitting with a complete stranger or do you. Are you okay and you're certain with who you are that's looking through those eyeballs.
[00:54:46] Speaker C: Oh, wow. I got real deep.
Like an identity crisis is coming up as soon as, like, meditating. I don't even know who I am.
[00:54:57] Speaker B: I know the work day's done.
[00:55:00] Speaker C: Everybody listening. It's okay if you don't know who you are either.
[00:55:04] Speaker A: You'll get there. You'll get there. Yeah. No, I mean, that's just things I think about on a lot lately. Huh.
[00:55:11] Speaker B: Love it. Well, I want to say too, and when we started, I feel like you mentioned that you. You wouldn't be traveling quite as much or you weren't sure how much you would be like, because you have like your own clinic and everything now. But so, you know, if you were amenable to any type of advice from a older person, not me, but me, I would just tell you to keep going because, like, yes, you need to focus on your practice and you need to grow and build, you know, something sustainable where you can help people and all those good things. But like, these experiences brought you to the place where you're at now to be able to. To start and have that. But it's probably going to be what helps you be able to keep that perspective where you are still being you and true to you and everything.
So don't be that person that, like, gets so stuck in practice that they don't like, take time off to go do other things because you have to. But also I think that it's. It's part of what brought you to where you are now and. And it seems like a good thing to keep around. For sure.
[00:56:13] Speaker C: Don't rob your soul.
[00:56:15] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:56:16] Speaker C: Calling open a practice abroad and then you always have an excuse to go visit.
[00:56:21] Speaker B: Always an idea.
[00:56:23] Speaker C: And us too.
[00:56:24] Speaker A: Yeah. That's awesome. Thank you for that advice too.
[00:56:27] Speaker B: Yeah, definitely.
[00:56:29] Speaker A: I needed that.
[00:56:30] Speaker B: All right, awesome. Well, thanks for coming to be here today. I feel like you need to come back and tell us how Uganda was.
[00:56:36] Speaker A: Yeah, for sure. Part two.
[00:56:38] Speaker B: Perfect.
All right, cool. So you did mention the website. It was Cairo missions dot com. Right. Okay, cool.
So if people want more information or just curious, I'm sure. Are there ways to like, help, support and even if people aren't going to go, but they want to be involved, like things they can do through that website?
[00:57:00] Speaker A: Yeah, they can. There's like donations and stuff you can do or if you want to give clothes or anything like that. There's ways that we have made it a little bit more efficient to ship the clothes or travel with certain clothes.
[00:57:16] Speaker C: Or just reach out to Dr. Mo when he's going and send a suitcase with them so we can take 30 checked back.
[00:57:22] Speaker A: Dude, honestly, that's happened to me quite a few times and I'm just like carrying all these luggages. I'm all like, okay, I didn't know if I signed up for all this. I'm all like the last person in the airport with five suitcases and no.
[00:57:34] Speaker C: One knows what you're doing. So it's like this ball.
[00:57:37] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:57:37] Speaker C: 30 checked bag.
[00:57:39] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. Exactly.
[00:57:41] Speaker B: Really funny.
[00:57:42] Speaker A: Thank y'all for having me. This was really cool. Yeah, I like yalls energy and the way y'all bounce off each other. You guys are awesome.
[00:57:48] Speaker C: Thanks.
[00:57:49] Speaker B: Thanks.
[00:57:50] Speaker C: And for our listeners, if you have any questions about today's episode or topics that you'd love for us to cover in the future, we want to hear from you. So send us an
[email protected] and we might feature your question in an upcoming episode. Thanks for tuning in to Chirocast. If you enjoyed it, don't forget to subscribe and leave us a review. Until next time. Keep adjusting. Inspiring and thriving.
[00:58:13] Speaker D: Thank you for joining us on this episode of Chirocast Insights for Modern Chiropractors, brought to you by ChiroTouch, hosted by Dr. Stephanie Brown and Danielle Hevinas, produced by Debbie Brooks, editing from Matthew Dodge. Our theme song, House 5 is from Scott W. Brooks. If you enjoyed today's show, don't forget to, like, link and subscribe. We appreciate your support and we'll catch you next time.
